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RE: The 2017 Seattle Mariners thread
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As expected, Safeco Field was flooded with Toronto Blue Jays fans, who flocked across the border to root for their team.  The Jays took an early 2-0 lead, but couldn't hold it, as Seattle came back to post a 4-2 win.

Run-scoring singles by Danny Valencia and Jarrod Dyson in the seventh inning put the Mariners ahead, 3-2, and Kyle Seager added an RBI single in the eighth.

Sam Gaviglio tossed six innings, allowing both Toronto runs.

Tyler Cloyd pitched a scoreless seventh and gained the win in his first major League appearance since 2013.  Nick Vincent struck out the side (working around a pair of singles) in the eighth, and Edwin Diaz was filthy in the ninth for the save.

Diaz struck out Kevin Pillar on a 101-MPH heater to end the game, after fanning Ryan Goins for the second out.  Diaz was throwing free and easy, hitting 100 or better four times. He seems to have worked through the problems that hampered him earlier in the season.

Cloyd was pitching for Sommerset, in the independent Atlantic League earlier in the year.  He was signed as a free agent May 12th and assigned to Tacoma.  In four starts for the Rainiers, covering 16.1 innings, he posted a 1.10 ERA.



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Toronto topped Seattle, 4-2, Saturday night, in front of a full house of mostly Blue Jays fans.

They really pour into Seattle when the Jays are in town.

Ezequiel Carerra broke a 2-2 tie with an eighth-inning homer off reliever Tony Zych, and Justin Smoak added another solo shot in the ninth, off reliever Steve Cishek.

Smoak has hit three homers off his former team this season, and now has 18 for the year.

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It's been a pretty good homestand, so far.  A win today (Paxton pitching), and the M's finish it off 8-3.

Seven games at Minnesota (4) and Texas are next (3), with another nine-game home stand to follow.  Mitch Haniger is due back (possibly today, certainly for the trip), with Felix hopefully rejoining the club this coming week.

It looks like the plan is to have Felix ready to start June 17th at Texas.  Yovani Gallardo is scheduled to pitch tomorrow in Minnesota, and a Felix start Saturday night would essentially allow him to step into Gallardo's slot.  That give the M's Paxton-Felix-Christian Bergman for the three games in Texas.

A couple of weeks ago, I previewed a stretch of 20 games the Mariners were looking to, after leaving Boston.  It started with a two-road/two-home split series with Colorado, continued through the rest of what would be an 11-game home stand, and the following seven-game road trip to Minnesota and Texas.

I wrote that I thought Seattle had a chance to 13-7 in those games, setting them up for another nine-game homestand.

Say, the M's win today, then take just three of the seven road games, they will have gone exactly 13-7.  That's 35-36, with a nine-game homestand to follow.  After that, it's three in Anaheim, then another short homestand against Kansas City (3) and Oakland (4), before the All-Star Break.

I'm thinking 45-45, which will give them a mark of 24-16 over their last 40 games heading into the break.

That's far cry from 21-29, which is where they languished after the back-to-back shutouts in Boston.



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seajaw wrote:

It's been a pretty good homestand, so far.  A win today (Paxton pitching), and the M's finish it off 8-3.

Seven games at Minnesota (4) and Texas are next (3), with another nine-game home stand to follow.  Mitch Haniger is due back (possibly today, certainly for the trip), with Felix hopefully rejoining the club this coming week.

It looks like the plan is to have Felix ready to start June 17th at Texas.  Yovani Gallardo is scheduled to pitch tomorrow in Minnesota, and a Felix start Saturday night would essentially allow him to step into Gallardo's slot.  That give the M's Paxton-Felix-Christian Bergman for the three games in Texas.

A couple of weeks ago, I previewed a stretch of 20 games the Mariners were looking to, after leaving Boston.  It started with a two-road/two-home split series with Colorado, continued through the rest of what would be an 11-game home stand, and the following seven-game road trip to Minnesota and Texas.

I wrote that I thought Seattle had a chance to 13-7 in those games, setting them up for another nine-game homestand.

Say, the M's win today, then take just three of the seven road games, they will have gone exactly 13-7.  That's 35-36, with a nine-game homestand to follow.  After that, it's three in Anaheim, then another short homestand against Kansas City (3) and Oakland (4), before the All-Star Break.

I'm thinking 45-45, which will give them a mark of 24-16 over their last 40 games heading into the break.

That's far cry from 21-29, which is where they languished after the back-to-back shutouts in Boston.


 You made a point earlier about Houston and their injuries.  The difference to me is, Houston now has been there for a couple/three years now.  If it was their first foray into success, then I could see the wheels falling off a bit.

Now no offense, but if it were the other way around (with Seattle off to a big start), then I may worry a bit.  I could plug any team into that top spot instead of Seattle, that hasn't tasted success in awhile.  OK....I'll plug in Colorado.......



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VP of Operations

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nacster wrote:
seajaw wrote:

It's been a pretty good homestand, so far.  A win today (Paxton pitching), and the M's finish it off 8-3.

Seven games at Minnesota (4) and Texas are next (3), with another nine-game home stand to follow.  Mitch Haniger is due back (possibly today, certainly for the trip), with Felix hopefully rejoining the club this coming week.

It looks like the plan is to have Felix ready to start June 17th at Texas.  Yovani Gallardo is scheduled to pitch tomorrow in Minnesota, and a Felix start Saturday night would essentially allow him to step into Gallardo's slot.  That give the M's Paxton-Felix-Christian Bergman for the three games in Texas.

A couple of weeks ago, I previewed a stretch of 20 games the Mariners were looking to, after leaving Boston.  It started with a two-road/two-home split series with Colorado, continued through the rest of what would be an 11-game home stand, and the following seven-game road trip to Minnesota and Texas.

I wrote that I thought Seattle had a chance to 13-7 in those games, setting them up for another nine-game homestand.

Say, the M's win today, then take just three of the seven road games, they will have gone exactly 13-7.  That's 35-36, with a nine-game homestand to follow.  After that, it's three in Anaheim, then another short homestand against Kansas City (3) and Oakland (4), before the All-Star Break.

I'm thinking 45-45, which will give them a mark of 24-16 over their last 40 games heading into the break.

That's far cry from 21-29, which is where they languished after the back-to-back shutouts in Boston.


 You made a point earlier about Houston and their injuries.  The difference to me is, Houston now has been there for a couple/three years now.  If it was their first foray into success, then I could see the wheels falling off a bit.

Now no offense, but if it were the other way around (with Seattle off to a big start), then I may worry a bit.  I could plug any team into that top spot instead of Seattle, that hasn't tasted success in awhile.  OK....I'll plug in Colorado.......


The point about Houston was due to their loss of 4/5's of their starting rotation, and how they would deal with it.

Since their 11-game winning streak was snapped, they have lost three of five.  They have a three-game series with the Rangers that starts Monday, followed by Boston next weekend.

Looking at the upcoming games preview on the Astros' baseref team page, Houston has no starting pitchers lined up (Texas at least has Darvish and Cashner slotted) beyond today.

They could get beat up real bad.



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Just to add to that last bit...

I'm not currently looking at catching Houston, though history indicates it is possible. Just pointing out that the Astros had (to the date I made the original comment) not really had to deal with any adversity.

I do believe the M's have the opportunity to whittle Houston's lead down, from 13 games, to around 9-10 by the break. After that, who knows?

Right now, however, the Mariners are just 1-1/2 games behind the Orioles for the second Wild Card spot, in a very mediocre league. That is very doable.

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seajaw wrote:
nacster wrote:
seajaw wrote:

It's been a pretty good homestand, so far.  A win today (Paxton pitching), and the M's finish it off 8-3.

Seven games at Minnesota (4) and Texas are next (3), with another nine-game home stand to follow.  Mitch Haniger is due back (possibly today, certainly for the trip), with Felix hopefully rejoining the club this coming week.

It looks like the plan is to have Felix ready to start June 17th at Texas.  Yovani Gallardo is scheduled to pitch tomorrow in Minnesota, and a Felix start Saturday night would essentially allow him to step into Gallardo's slot.  That give the M's Paxton-Felix-Christian Bergman for the three games in Texas.

A couple of weeks ago, I previewed a stretch of 20 games the Mariners were looking to, after leaving Boston.  It started with a two-road/two-home split series with Colorado, continued through the rest of what would be an 11-game home stand, and the following seven-game road trip to Minnesota and Texas.

I wrote that I thought Seattle had a chance to 13-7 in those games, setting them up for another nine-game homestand.

Say, the M's win today, then take just three of the seven road games, they will have gone exactly 13-7.  That's 35-36, with a nine-game homestand to follow.  After that, it's three in Anaheim, then another short homestand against Kansas City (3) and Oakland (4), before the All-Star Break.

I'm thinking 45-45, which will give them a mark of 24-16 over their last 40 games heading into the break.

That's far cry from 21-29, which is where they languished after the back-to-back shutouts in Boston.


 You made a point earlier about Houston and their injuries.  The difference to me is, Houston now has been there for a couple/three years now.  If it was their first foray into success, then I could see the wheels falling off a bit.

Now no offense, but if it were the other way around (with Seattle off to a big start), then I may worry a bit.  I could plug any team into that top spot instead of Seattle, that hasn't tasted success in awhile.  OK....I'll plug in Colorado.......


The point about Houston was due to their loss of 4/5's of their starting rotation, and how they would deal with it.

Since their 11-game winning streak was snapped, they have lost three of five.  They have a three-game series with the Rangers that starts Monday, followed by Boston next weekend.

Looking at the upcoming games preview on the Astros' baseref team page, Houston has no starting pitchers lined up (Texas at least has Darvish and Cashner slotted) beyond today.

They could get beat up real bad.


 I don't disagree with the injury angle hurting them........my comment was more they know, from past success, how to manage daily issues.  

OK it is a totally different team........but look at the Patriots when they lost Brady last year.  They coached everybody up, and played very well.  Yes two different sports, but look what happened when someone like Andrew Luck went down, the team went into the tank.

All they need to do is tread water.

PS.....I remember one year the Yankees started out losing three of their first five games and everybody wanted Joe Torre fired LOL.



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"NACSTER'S HISTORICAL REPLAY"

33 REPLAYS IN THE BOOKS!

1876-1883

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1906

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1976

1986

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37,117 regular season games through 34 replays!

 

 



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Well, I was gone most of the day, and missed the game.

It looks like James Paxton stumbled, and the M's fell, 4-0, to Toronto.

Good news, however, in that Mitch Haniger is back with the club after rehabbing an oblique injury.

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The Astros are placing Lance McCullers on the DL, due to lower back pain.

Word is, though, that they have activated starting pitcher Joe Musgrove for tonight's game.

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The Mariners have four rookies in tonight's starting lineup.  They are shortstop Tyler Smith (filling in for Jean Segura), and a complete outfield of Ben Gamel, Guillermo Heredia and Mitch Haniger.

They are raking tonight, and have pulled out in front of the Twins, 8-2, in the fourth inning.  Even Mike Zunino has two more hits.



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The final was 14-3, Seattle.

Minnesota backup catcher Chris Gimenez took on the roll of emergency pitcher for the fifth time this season, allowing the last two runs in his ninth inning appearance.

This presents us with an obvious trivia question (I don't know the answer): What is the record for most relief appearances in a season by someone who is considered to be a non-pitcher?

The obvious follow-up is: At what point does someone who is considered a "non-pitcher" become a "whatever-slash-pitcher" (as in first baseman/outfielder)?

Getting to the game itself, the kids are alright, as the Who might put it.

The four Mariner rookies -- Gamel, Haniger, Heredia and Smith -- were a combined 9-20, with two walks, nine runs scored, and two runs batted in.

Haniger, quickly bouncing back into form, was 4-5, with four runs scored and both RBI. Gamel had two hits, two walks, and scored three runs. With Gamel and Haniger batting 1-2, what happens when Jean Segura returns?

As good as Haniger has been, Gamel has great batting splits. He's batting .324 vs. lefties, and .328 against righties. Gamel only got called up when Leonys Martin was DFA'd. They had started playing Jarrod Dyson in center, flanked by Heredia and Haniger, when Martin was shipped out.

Then, Haniger got hurt, which opened the door for Gamel.

In all, the Mariners banged out 19 hits. Nelson Cruz was 2-4, with four ribbies. Danny Valencia and Mike Zunino hit back-to-back homers in the eighth. It was funny to watch, because they were showing the replay of Valencia's shot, when Zunino stepped in and hammered the first pitch he saw.

The at-bat was not actually shown (it was described as it happened), until there was another break in the action in the following at-bat. It was strange. I was sitting there, thinking, "Will we actually get a chance to see it?"

Anyway, Zunino had three hits in the game, and is now up to .233. He's hitting an even .400 (18-45) in his last 13 games, with four homers and 16 RBI, and .339 in the 17 games since his recall.

Segura, meanwhile, took some light infield drills, and is expected to do some running on Tuesday. He is way ahead of the original prognosis for his return.

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Man I gotta believe Gimenez already has the record, and it's only mid June.

Any team recently that has wanted to try it.....Cubs with Kieschnick, Reds with Owings, Padres with Betancourt and Francouer, haven't made it last for whatever reason. That being said, maybe something like this will push teams to really think about it more. Teams are already looking to carry guys like Zobrist or Marwin Gonzalez, the so called "Swiss army knife".

__________________

"NACSTER'S HISTORICAL REPLAY"

33 REPLAYS IN THE BOOKS!

1876-1883

1896-1900

1906

1916-1917

1921, 1929

1936-1937

1943, 1946

1956-1963

1976

1986

1991

37,117 regular season games through 34 replays!

 

 



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nacster wrote:

Man I gotta believe Gimenez already has the record, and it's only mid June.

Any team recently that has wanted to try it.....Cubs with Kieschnick, Reds with Owings, Padres with Betancourt and Francouer, haven't made it last for whatever reason. That being said, maybe something like this will push teams to really think about it more. Teams are already looking to carry guys like Zobrist or Marwin Gonzalez, the so called "Swiss army knife".


What's fascinating is that, if you go back through the years, it wasn't always the "Swiss Army Knife Guy."

Look what I found:

http://www.baseball-reference.com/friv/fieldPitch.shtml



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seajaw wrote:
nacster wrote:

Man I gotta believe Gimenez already has the record, and it's only mid June.

Any team recently that has wanted to try it.....Cubs with Kieschnick, Reds with Owings, Padres with Betancourt and Francouer, haven't made it last for whatever reason. That being said, maybe something like this will push teams to really think about it more. Teams are already looking to carry guys like Zobrist or Marwin Gonzalez, the so called "Swiss army knife".


What's fascinating is that, if you go back through the years, it wasn't always the "Swiss Army Knife Guy."

Look what I found:

http://www.baseball-reference.com/friv/fieldPitch.shtml


 You would have to do some serious separating.........removing the guys who played before 1900, then removing the Rick Ankiels and Willie Smiths.

Gimenez actually has EIGHT career pitching appearances.  That ranks 81st, and when you think of it (removing the Ruths and Gleasons and O'Douls and and Bresslers and Walters and Lemons), that number actually is a LOT.  Drew Butera has 5.

In fact, let us use 5 as the basement.  There have been 118 players who have pitched in 5 games that would be "considered" non-pitchers by the rule stated in the table.  SIXTY-FIVE of those occurred before the end of the 1800's.  That leaves 53 players.

Of those 53, 24 of those did it before 1920.  So that cuts us down to 29.  Only 29 players since 1920 have appeared in at least 5 games as a pitcher.

Let us cut a little further...let us go to 1940.  Since 1940......

--Johnny Cooney (1921-1944), in 24 years he pitched in 159 games (75 starts)

--Johnny Lindell (1941-1954), in 14 years he pitched in 55 games (28 starts)

--Rick Ankiel (1999-2013), in 15 years he pitched in 51 games (41 starts)

--Willie Smith (1963-1971), in 9 years he pitched in 29 games (3 starts)

--Ben Chapman (1930-1946), in 17 years he pitched in 25 games (16 starts)

--Johnny O'Brien (1953-1959), in 7 years he pitched in 25 games (1 start)

--Erv ("Four Sack") Dusak, one of the greatest nicknames of all time IMO (1941-1952), in 12 years he pitched in 23 games (3 starts)

--Jimmie Foxx (1925-1945) in 21 years he pitched in 10 games (2 starts)

--Chris Gimenez (2009-2017) in 9 years he has pitched in 8 games (0 starts)

--Granny Hamner (1944-1962) in 19 years he pitched in 7 games (0 starts)

--Vance Law (1980-1991) in 12 years he pitched in 7 games (0 starts)

--Christian Bethancourt (2013-2017) in 5 years he has pitched in 6 games (0 starts)

--Eddie Carnett (1941-1945) in 5 years he pitched in 6 games (0 starts)

--Eddie Lake (1939-1950) in 12 years he pitched in 6 games (0 starts)

--Bob Bowman (1955-1959) in 5 years he pitched in 5 games (0 starts)

--Drew Butera (2010-2017) in 8 years he has pitched in 5 games (0 starts)

--Kerby Ferrell (1943-1945) in 3 years he pitched in 5 games (0 starts)

--Ad Libke (1945-1946) in 2 years he pitched in 5 games (1 start)

--Aaron Miles (2003-2011) in 9 years he pitched in 5 games (0 starts)

--Eddie O'Brien (1953-1958) in 6 years he pitched in 5 games (1 start)

--Gil Torres (1940-1946) in 7 years he pitched in 5 games (0 starts)

That is 21 players.  So Gimenez actually has pitched the most career games of any "non-traditional pitcher" without making at least ONE career start.  I would say by that measure alone, he would be the record-holder for most appearances by a "non-traditional pitcher" who actually was not, nor ever was, a true pitcher.  Now obviously Jimmie Foxx was never a "true pitcher", and by the list above someone like Foxx ONLY started on some sort of "last day of the season" goofing around game (in fact 9 of his 10 career games as a pitcher were in his last year of 1945, a start on August 19th and a start on September 2nd).

 



__________________

"NACSTER'S HISTORICAL REPLAY"

33 REPLAYS IN THE BOOKS!

1876-1883

1896-1900

1906

1916-1917

1921, 1929

1936-1937

1943, 1946

1956-1963

1976

1986

1991

37,117 regular season games through 34 replays!

 

 



VP of Operations

Status: Offline
Posts: 16142
Date: 9 days ago
Permalink  
 

nacster wrote:
seajaw wrote:
nacster wrote:

Man I gotta believe Gimenez already has the record, and it's only mid June.

Any team recently that has wanted to try it.....Cubs with Kieschnick, Reds with Owings, Padres with Betancourt and Francouer, haven't made it last for whatever reason. That being said, maybe something like this will push teams to really think about it more. Teams are already looking to carry guys like Zobrist or Marwin Gonzalez, the so called "Swiss army knife".


What's fascinating is that, if you go back through the years, it wasn't always the "Swiss Army Knife Guy."

Look what I found:

http://www.baseball-reference.com/friv/fieldPitch.shtml


 You would have to do some serious separating.........removing the guys who played before 1900, then removing the Rick Ankiels and Willie Smiths.

Gimenez actually has EIGHT career pitching appearances.  That ranks 81st, and when you think of it (removing the Ruths and Gleasons and O'Douls and and Bresslers and Walters and Lemons), that number actually is a LOT.  Drew Butera has 5.

In fact, let us use 5 as the basement.  There have been 118 players who have pitched in 5 games that would be "considered" non-pitchers by the rule stated in the table.  SIXTY-FIVE of those occurred before the end of the 1800's.  That leaves 53 players.

Of those 53, 24 of those did it before 1920.  So that cuts us down to 29.  Only 29 players since 1920 have appeared in at least 5 games as a pitcher.

Let us cut a little further...let us go to 1940.  Since 1940......

--Johnny Cooney (1921-1944), in 24 years he pitched in 159 games (75 starts)

--Johnny Lindell (1941-1954), in 14 years he pitched in 55 games (28 starts)

--Rick Ankiel (1999-2013), in 15 years he pitched in 51 games (41 starts)

--Willie Smith (1963-1971), in 9 years he pitched in 29 games (3 starts)

--Ben Chapman (1930-1946), in 17 years he pitched in 25 games (16 starts)

--Johnny O'Brien (1953-1959), in 7 years he pitched in 25 games (1 start)

--Erv ("Four Sack") Dusak, one of the greatest nicknames of all time IMO (1941-1952), in 12 years he pitched in 23 games (3 starts)

--Jimmie Foxx (1925-1945) in 21 years he pitched in 10 games (2 starts)

--Chris Gimenez (2009-2017) in 9 years he has pitched in 8 games (0 starts)

--Granny Hamner (1944-1962) in 19 years he pitched in 7 games (0 starts)

--Vance Law (1980-1991) in 12 years he pitched in 7 games (0 starts)

--Christian Bethancourt (2013-2017) in 5 years he has pitched in 6 games (0 starts)

--Eddie Carnett (1941-1945) in 5 years he pitched in 6 games (0 starts)

--Eddie Lake (1939-1950) in 12 years he pitched in 6 games (0 starts)

--Bob Bowman (1955-1959) in 5 years he pitched in 5 games (0 starts)

--Drew Butera (2010-2017) in 8 years he has pitched in 5 games (0 starts)

--Kerby Ferrell (1943-1945) in 3 years he pitched in 5 games (0 starts)

--Ad Libke (1945-1946) in 2 years he pitched in 5 games (1 start)

--Aaron Miles (2003-2011) in 9 years he pitched in 5 games (0 starts)

--Eddie O'Brien (1953-1958) in 6 years he pitched in 5 games (1 start)

--Gil Torres (1940-1946) in 7 years he pitched in 5 games (0 starts)

That is 21 players.  So Gimenez actually has pitched the most career games of any "non-traditional pitcher" without making at least ONE career start.  I would say by that measure alone, he would be the record-holder for most appearances by a "non-traditional pitcher" who actually was not, nor ever was, a true pitcher.  Now obviously Jimmie Foxx was never a "true pitcher", and by the list above someone like Foxx ONLY started on some sort of "last day of the season" goofing around game (in fact 9 of his 10 career games as a pitcher were in his last year of 1945, a start on August 19th and a start on September 2nd).

 


True.  But now we have something to work from.

Foxx returned to Philly in '45, wishing to do whatever he could to help the team.  He pitched in to help the club, you might say. wink

Bressler and a number of others on the list were obviously guys who were "slash" players, as I referred to earlier.  Like a first baseman/outfielder.

Lindell and Ankiel were "conversions," guys who started out as one thing, then converted in order to try to keep a job.  Lindell started as an outfielder, then converted to pitching, and Ankiel did the reverse.



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Just sitting in his basement, with a Strat game underway."

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